Do I Need To Lap My New Scope Rings

[SomeSoldier]

I just received my new single piece scope mount in the mail. Should I lap this mount or can I even lap this mount? I sent an email to manufacturer but have not heard back yet. I would like to mount this up to shoot this weekend.

http://vortexoptics.com/product/vort...iflescope-tube

[Liberty's Teeth]

Short answer; Nope
Set your scope and tighten to spec. Then try to rotate tube in rings by hand. Should be snug as a bug.
Nice scope rig you bought!

[SomeSoldier]

Thanks for the info.

[Meketrefe]

I would be more worried about flex with a long cantilever like that. How heavy and long is the glass? Do they have a shorter cantilever with the 1st ring not further than 1/2 the distance of the actual base?
As far as lapping normally not needed. It is easy to check with a bit of chalk or easy erase marker. I guess it depends also in the finish of the scope like anodized vs teflon vs rubberized epoxy finish etc... in order to make a positive and durable lock wo over torkeing.

[SomeSoldier]

Here is the optic.

http://vortexoptics.com/product/razo...eticle/reticle

[SomeSoldier]

Sorry about google link but I couldn't get rid of the link and it was being a PIA.

[Meketrefe]

Awesome glass!!!
That should be fine but if you want something stronger check other mounts. How tall are you? I don't think that you need that much cantilever to be able to properly mount
the razor even with the shortest possible stock. It is 4 inch relief and I think a stronger design will reduce the chance of things going wrong. As you know T6 like most
alloys and metals flexes and it can be bent. A few years back I did some tests with some mounts and cantilevers and found out that a few pounds of pressure can produce 1-3 thousands deviations that is why I stick to the old directives in bolt action (steel against steel) but also in the AR basic with some basic formulas. In most uses and situations you most likely will be fine but these 30mm tubes are very strong and the mount might give due to the torque put by the long cantilever.

Personally I put the 'brand' factor and fashion aside and look for something very strong. I can use the scope as a carry handle if I want and never loose zero.
A good mount is not going to be cheap but those vortex are not cheap neither so might even spend less and have something bomb proof.

And one doesn't have to spend an eye on a sphur mount to get something super strong.

Also do you have a rail over the handguard? There is another trick to make that weak upper shank area of the AR stronger.

[Meketrefe]

I forgot... also avoid la rue or any other QD that uses the cam to bite in the reciever. Instead look for something with a wide contact area and strong
bolts whether they are QD or not. La rue are popular but they are not that great. Functionality first ... then coolness.

[SomeSoldier]

Awesome glass!!!
That should be fine but if you want something stronger check other mounts. How tall are you? I don't think that you need that much cantilever to be able to properly mount
the razor even with the shortest possible stock. It is 4 inch relief and I think a stronger design will reduce the chance of things going wrong. As you know T6 like most
alloys and metals flexes and it can be bent. A few years back I did some tests with some mounts and cantilevers and found out that a few pounds of pressure can produce 1-3 thousands deviations that is why I stick to the old directives in bolt action (steel against steel) but also in the AR basic with some basic formulas. In most uses and situations you most likely will be fine but these 30mm tubes are very strong and the mount might give due to the torque put by the long cantilever.

Personally I put the 'brand' factor and fashion aside and look for something very strong. I can use the scope as a carry handle if I want and never loose zero.
A good mount is not going to be cheap but those vortex are not cheap neither so might even spend less and have something bomb proof.

And one doesn't have to spend an eye on a sphur mount to get something super strong.

Also do you have a rail over the handguard? There is another trick to make that weak upper shank area of the AR stronger.

Yes I have a rail over the handguard. I am 5'11" but I tend to run my rifle 1-2 notches in on the buttstock.

This is the rifle the setup is going on.

https://www.lwrci.com/p-330-ic-spr.aspx

[Meketrefe]

Very nice carbine!!. LWRC uses their own system so it might not be that critical
But in any case there is always the same opportunity to put a extension (raiser) between the front half and the reciever.
Never allow the optics mount to ride over the front rail. Instead use an extension or something else.
In the AR that is one of the weak points because the reciever shank is always the same dimension no matter what. It has to be to allow
for the barrel nut. Not a huge thing only when shooting prone, perhaps a bit downslope where one might put some extra pounds on the
bipod / handguard and therefore the shank and barrel flexes with it. Not 100% necessary but it makes the halfs more rigid pretty much
like an integral handguard system.

I have all sort of mounts so let me know if you have any questions. I like the idea of something that has more 'meat' around the rings
and base are even if it is a couple extra ounces.

again, nothing huge. I am not sure if maximum accuracy is a concern for your use but in any case those are simple things to do.
If you were worried about lapping these things are far more important.

[SomeSoldier]

I am setting this up to be a 3gun rifle. Though it won't be used as such until I leave the state in about a year. I really like the idea of QR mount because I have a micro T1 that could swapped quickly. The only nice part about using that scope with that mount in their warranty. If you have never read Vortex VIP warranty I would suggest checking it out.

[Meketrefe]

I know vortex. I have a couple of vipers too. Amazing customer service.

It seems you are putting some serious though into quality equipment so let me give you a few more ideas...

The thing with the mount is not so much the warranty as not many things can go wrong with a mount (in theory) but if you want something sturdier that can hold zero no matter what (including battle type of duty) I would look at other options, specially for 3 gun or any rigorous duty including service rifles. .... I just don't understand these other fancy trends to be honest and it is not like this is inexpensive equipment anyway.

I think one should avoid the long unsuported cantilevers but also any with screws at the base of the rings so Larue and American defense (any cantilever version) and Aero Precission are automatically discarded. Also for a QD nothing beats the security of a dual cam. So the GG&G are also automatically discarded. single cam QDs have failed in competition or heavy use.
Any hindges and pivots also reduce the strength so American Rifle also discarded.

I think the Badger is hard to beat for the price but they do not have QD (For a reason too). How often do you swap them? there are some very small tools one can keep in the pistol grip for a quick change. The Geisselle (Sopmod certified) is also a nice one but IMO not worth the price step from the badger. You also have the Midwest new line with QD that are substantially beefed up. There are several OEM bases that are amazing. Not the ones that Burris uses that one can find under serveral brands and ebay but a beefed up.
Vortex and Warne also use OEM mounts rebranded but I like something even stronger.

I put this one of these TMS OEM mounts on the mill and measured with the micrometer after putting as much as 40 pounds of pressure. It is at least 3 times stronger than any of the cantilevers mentioned above.... http://www.ebay.com/itm/TMS-One-Piec...eMAAOSwo6lWIBS t
It is the same as primary arms sells and others. They do becasue they do not make anything. they just put a brand on top. In this case the best way to go with this much cantilever is without the QD system.

But seriouly the Badger is hard to beat. Or the Geisselle that you have one actually certified for the 1-6 Razor. It is just money!!!!

https://geissele.com/sopmod-certifie...-platform.html




Geissele.... like badger these are not oem...they have very nice machining capabilities. Their triggers are top of the line too.





Badger less sexy but they come with 20moa cant and also use the same screws and bolts you have in the military grade rings.
Think of it as two sturdy military grade rings coupled for extra support.





If you still want more cantilever the BO recon is a better option than any of the fancy ones people buy.....





review

Midwest (I have not tried this one but I have been told they hold up really well under heavy, hunting, etc..)
notice 4 torx screws per ring vs. the earlier mounts from MI.









Wrong way to mount a scope.....

[Meketrefe]

...btw... normally folks should buy the moutns after they have the scope, stock and everything else so you can also decide on dimensions.
Specially height of the rings and have the whole rifle fitted to the shooter vs. the shooter having to adapt to specific dimensions.
So one might want to take some rings or stacks of coins and tape and write down some numbers before ordering any rings.
With some scopes and/or hunting rifles this is critical otherwise one might find out the hard way something is too tall or too
low and even the bell fo the scope can touch forward. Also consider backup iron sights and put them in order to measure.
Things and measures need to work on paper before they can work in the final setup and ideally before ordering.

[SomeSoldier]

I really like that Geisselle mount, though I don't think it would allow for BUIS. The Midwest looks good but it's almost what I have now. The Badger looks ok but I already spent the money on the Vortex mount, if I return it, it will be a for a Geisselle.

Edit:
I installed the scope in the Vortex mount. I will take pictures tomorrow.

[SomeSoldier]