ProgSpear Build thread - AR15 tack driver.

[Cgrutt]

OK, I have a couple of questions regarding one of the great evil features is defined in unSAFE. The exact text is:

(VI) A FLASH SUPPRESSOR, MUZZLE BREAK, MUZZLE COMPENSATOR, OR THREADED BARREL DESIGNED TO ACCOMMODATE A FLASH SUPPRESSOR, MUZZLE BREAK, OR MUZZLE COMPENSATOR;

My questions pertain to the "OR THREADED BARREL DESIGNED TO ACCOMMODATE" phrase. It's generally assumed that if a "thread protector" is pinned and welded to the barrel that the previously evil barrel has been rendered angelic. First, has that assumption ever been officially acknowledged as valid? Second, a welded pin is considered permanent. Loctite Red 271 is also advertized as being permanent, so why could you not use Loctite Red to make the barrel compliant?

Note that one could grind off a weld retaining a pin just as easily as heating a Loctited barrel to 500 degrees. Also, to prove the lunacy of this law, one could easily put a clamp on "break" on a target barrel, turning it into an evil rage filled terroristic baby killing machine.

EDIT: Hey Meke! I see you did something bad on the "other place".

Unfortunately nobody knows and NYS certainly won't provide any guidance. Clear as mud or in other words intentionally vague and ambiguous.

I believe the guidance you refer to dates back to an old ATF opinion issued after the first ban under Clinton. Pin and weld, perimeter weld (at least 3 points) and silver solder were cited as acceptable methods to permanently attach a removable compensator or brake. All that is gone under current law so who knows what is acceptable anymore. We need a court ruling or repeal of this abomination of a law designed only to infringe upon law abiding citizens rights protected by the 2nd amendment.

[ProgSpear]

Unfortunately nobody knows and NYS certainly won't provide any guidance. Clear as mud or in other words intentionally vague and ambiguous.

I believe the guidance you refer to dates back to an old ATF opinion issued after the first ban under Clinton. Pin and weld, perimeter weld (at least 3 points) and silver solder were cited as acceptable methods to permanently attach a removable compensator or brake. All that is gone under current law so who knows what is acceptable anymore. We need a court ruling or repeal of this abomination of a law designed only to infringe upon law abiding citizens rights protected by the 2nd amendment.

well hey, that's just swell, the ATF (wascally little gun wunners they are) issued an OPINION back when, and NYS has zero guidance on record. This is so absolutely stupid, as anyone with a metal lathe and some minor degree of competency could put threads on a barrel OR smooth them out and use a slip on "break" (dumasses couldn't even spell right). Morons! I am disinclined to despoil a perfectly good Les Baer barrel to suit some bunch of numbnut politicians. Grrrr....

[Cgrutt]

Just responding to your question bro but it seems you had a different agenda lol.

[ProgSpear]

Just responding to your question bro but it seems you had a different agenda lol.

Awww heck, it isn't your fault. I really didn't have an "agenda" but sometimes the sheer stupidity is overwhelming...

[ProgSpear]

Directly rom the ATF NFA Handbook, section 2.1.3 Rifles - https://www.atf.gov/file/58196/download

The ATF procedure for measuring barrel length is to measure from the closed bolt (or breech-face) to the furthermost end of the barrel or permanently attached muzzle device. Permanent methods of attachment include full-fusion gas or electric steel-seam welding, high-temperature (1100°F) silver soldering, or blind pinning with the pin head welded over. Barrels are measured by inserting a dowel rod into the barrel until the rod stops against the bolt or breech-face. The rod is then marked at the furthermost end of the barrel or permanently attached muzzle device, withdrawn from the barrel, and measured.

Emphasis was in the original.

And now we all know.

[thughes]

Applies for Fed ATF, not necessarily for NY.

[Meketrefe]

Before safe Ars from stag, rra and others were sold at stores with a pinned brake. Just pinned.
These were considered permanent.
Compliance conversion has always been an option.
If one cuts bwfore the baffles a brake that has been pemanently attached then what is left is a cap/tube that is permanently attached. Safe didnt make something permanent to be inpermanent.
So a pin sleeve or cut brake is compliant.

[ProgSpear]

Safe didnt make something permanent to be inpermanent.

Cool, so all my rights have been restored.

So a pin sleeve or cut brake is compliant.

OK, pin it is.

[Meketrefe]

I think we care too much about this BS law.

[thughes]

I think we care too much about this BS law.

or not..........

[ProgSpear]

I think we care too much about this BS law.

I just can't afford to be the test case. I wonder if anyone on the "Shark Tank" would be willing to have equity in it.

[Meketrefe]

I never heard of anyone with problems with the pinned sleeve or cap and the FRS stock. Actually I never heard of anyone with trouble due to any compliant rifles
other than the case in Buffalo with the mag lock when someone called the cops for those guys shooting in that abandoned quarry that supposedly hit a house.
Never heard of anyone doing any SAFE BS enforcement in any clubs or ranges.
Many people in law enforcement have been very vocal locally that they will not enforce on innocent civilians.
Of course criminals will be charged with SAFE violations but those most likely would have been crimes before SAFE too.
That is the only way SAFE can get some scores to justify this non sense law and unnecessary expense to the clueless new yorkers.

[ProgSpear]

OK, screw it all, and the state and FUAC and FUBHO. Meke - what alloy is needed for the pin?

[Meketrefe]

you could use a roll pin but if you have stainless just get a stainless pin or just a small stainless screw/bolt and cut it a small size 1/8. you don't want to go too deep.
you can use a 1/8 bit and a bit larger bolt because the threads in the screw will collapse. Use a good support in the vise. A copule of pices of 2x4 and some long nose
pliers will do to drive the pin with a punch. drill on the joint so you do not damage the threads. It is also a stronger "more permanent" job.

Well there is nothing permanent on earth, not even ourselves, not even the planet that will become cosmic dust when our sun explodes. LOL